I just finished switching my 26U from a Westerbeke 18 to an ElectricYacht QT 10.0 Sport electric propulsion system.
This was supposed to be about a week effort. In terms of time on task, it was sorta close to that. The yard put in about 14 hours and I did about another 48 hours. Unfortunately, a combination of health, weather, family, and other issues ended up spreading those 62 hours over four months. Which is way too long to not be sailing.
If anyone’s interested, here’s a link to a write-up and picture portfolio on the experience:
Last time I posted about this, someone asked for pictures. If you follow the link above, there are 47 of 'em for your entertainment. Small versions in the text document, full size in a folder of pictures.
Congrats, we love the QT 10.0 in our NS26U. You were wise to have the yard do some of the work. For us it took two men a full day to remove everything and another day to clean and prep before the install. Here is a shot of our fuel tank after we removed it, it was a very noisy job, probably the hardest part.
Tim in STL
White O’morn NS26U #216
Harbor Point Yacht Club
West Alton, MO
Curious to know why you found it necessary to remove the fuel tank? Was it leaking? I kept mine in the boat. I steamed clean it and plan on converting it into a non potable water tank for fresh water wash downs collecting water off of my solar panels mostly.
Congrats, we love the QT 10.0 in our NS26U. You were wise to have the yard do some of the work. For us it took two men a full day to remove everything and another day to clean and prep before the install. Here is a shot of our fuel tank after we removed it, it was a very noisy job, probably the hardest part.
Tim in STL
White O’morn NS26U #216
Harbor Point Yacht Club
West Alton, MO
When we bought White O’morn she did not have a holding tank. The tank that would normally be the holding tank was used as an additional fresh water tank, we converted that tank to use for fresh water flushing of the head. We keep White O’morn at a dock in a harbor that provides free pump out service and we have dockside fresh water and electricity, we do not need a 26 gallon holding tank. We thought about converting the fuel tank to a holding tank, but since it was 35 years old I felt it was safer to replace it with a new molded poly holding tank. So now we have a new holding tank, fresh water flushing, and dockside washdown – plus a little bit more room for fenders, lines, and tools. Different ships, different long splices.
Tim in STL
White O’morn NS26U #216
Harbor Point Yacht Club
West Alton, MO
Sounds like a very nice set-up all around, Tim, both the boat and your marina. I installed fresh water flush on my previous Nonsuch and am planning to do the same in the near future on this one. Once you’ve experienced it, anything less is just not the same.
Two person-days for dismantling and clean-up sounds about right, although in my case that time was split between the yard and me.
One of the surprises for me (although in hindsight, not surprising) was how many electrical connections there were. I spent a big chunk of time disconnecting and removing no-longer needed wires. I don’t know if this was the case in general, but I was also surprised to discover that about half my 12V system grounded back to the 12V batteries, but the other half had been grounded back to the motor. It took a while to figure that out and get them back on-line.
We only had a few going to the batteries but, how about this for a ground buss, a 1/4-20 bolt. Changing that system lead me down a very long convoluted rabbit hole.
Tim in STL
White O’morn NS26U #216
Harbor Point Yacht Club
West Alton, MO
The beer can in the fuel tank may explain some of the issues you were having with the old diesel engine.
A shout out to all of you that have gone down the electric pathway. Now we need a directory page listing the electric Nonsuch fleet with a summary of the systems and performance.
Congrats on completion of the electric conversion, looks great!
I’m interested to get a report on the performance once you’ve had a few weeks of testing. My cursory reading about electric sailboats is that optimal speed vs battery life is +/-4.5 knots. Beyond that, batteries are drawn down much quicker. Slower speeds allow for longer battery life, but can become painfully slow.
I have some experience on this topic as I have a electric dinghy outboard. Consumption meter says at 4.5 kts I have just 80 minutes of battery life. But if I reduce speed to 3.5 kts, battery life increases to 5 hours. But I’ve never ran it down to check accuracy of the metre.
So, please let us know your actual battery vs speed results.
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Thanks
Don
I’ll have to do an update when I’ve had more time for testing.
The prop information I gave ElectricYacht, although based on best information I had, turned out to be wrong enough that I have to change the gearing. I’m currently getting about 75% of the full potential of the motor. I’m impressed to note that this is still enough to get the boat to 6.1 kts in flat water. The factory’s been very helpful with this. I have the replacement gear already in hand, received 48 hours after discussing it with them. Just have to do the work to install it.
Meanwhile, here’s a table of what they promise for battery life.
This is from advertising material published by ElectricYacht for the 48V 200 Amp configuration I went with. It does seem to suggest that the balance between speed and range is at about 3 kts, or half speed.
Note that Flooded or AGM batteries appear to provide slightly better range/operating time than LiFePo4 at lower speeds, while the reverse is true at higher. However, this is comparing them all at discharge to 80% of capacity. Beyond that point, you’re not going to get much more from a Flooded or AGM battery before voltage drops below usability, and you’re risking reducing the batteries’ lifetime. LiFePo4 batteries don’t have that problem. They provide near-full power to 100% discharge, with no long-term consequences. This implies effective LifePo4 ranges / operating times (and range) might actually be as much as 25% greater than shown here.
As the saying goes, “In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they’re not.” I’m looking forward to getting enough use to compare theory to practice.
However, what it basically comes down to is that no one switches to electric for the range. It only makes sense to switch if the range is acceptable for the uses and conditions you expect and the total amp hours of battery capacity you’re willing to pay for.
Bob, what did you do about weight distribution? We went with AGM batteries, eight six volts that weigh almost as much as the old diesel. We pushed the batteries as far back as practical and the boat still sits a little bit low by the bow. We had to take the CQR off of the bow roller to get her to sit level.
With the LifePo4 weighing half of the AGM weight i would think that correcting the weight distribution would be a problem.
Tim in STL
White O’morn NS26U #216
Harbor Point Yacht Club
West Alton, MO
I threw money at the situation and installed eight 12V 100 Amp LiFeP04 batteries to get a 48V 200 Amp system. The combined weight of the batteries was 248 lbs, plus the 75 lb electric motor, yields 323 lbs compared to the 345 lb engine. I also have the advantage of a lighter weight carbon fiber mast.
I put everything as far back as I could. All this doesn’t quite make up for it all since I also lost the weight of the diesel fuel tank, muffler, and other fittings.
A level placed on my cockpit seats suggests that they’re approximately level fore and aft, but I haven’t really got a good look at the waterline post installation to verify.
In contrast, after the diesel and accoutrements were out but before the batteries and motor went in, the boat was several inches bow-heavy.
Hmmmm I just pulled 400+ pounds of AGM batteries out of BIANKA. Planning on replacing then with a 100 pound Lithium. I still have the 30 gallon fuel tank that I plan to turn into a non potable wash down tank. Might have to think about adding another water tank down below or store a heavy storm anchor to even things out.
Ironically, according to https://goodcalculators.com/money-weight-calculator/, the amount I spent on my conversion if piled up in $1 USD coins would work out to a tad over 354 lbs. In other words, the money I put in is about equal to the weight I took out.
This illustrates what they say about every boat design question being a tradeoff.
If I’d removed the diesel and placed the money strategically throughout the boat, I could have achieved perfect balance.
But then, I wouldn’t have an engine.
Since I spent the money on the conversion instead of using it as ballast, now I have a balance problem instead.
The obvious answer is… I need to put more money into the boat.
Bags of U.S. quarters might work and would come in handy for laundry machines in marinas. Though gold bars might work too and would be more in line with boat owning. I’ll have to see how things play out after I install the new lithium battery. The main reason I want to install the single 48 volt Lithium battery is so I can access it’s terminals from inside the cabin as climbing down into the cockpit locker is getting harder as I get older. In addition the single battery eliminates any inter connections between 12 volt batteries. At least that’s the plan.
I had it told to me as a “fibreglass hole in the water”. If we keep on about heavy gold ballast, the boat will sink and you’ll be left with … just a hole in the water.
I’ll have to see how things play out after I install the new lithium battery. The main reason I want to install the single 48 volt Lithium battery is so I can access it’s terminals from inside the cabin as climbing down into the cockpit locker is getting harder as I get older. In addition the single battery eliminates any inter connections between 12 volt batteries. At least that’s the plan.
