I have been reading this thread prior to my purchase and it is great. Thanks to all. I just purchased a 1986 Nonsuch 26C #172 ex Cracker Jack new name TBD. The boat is located in Marblehead MA. The boat has been up on the hard for some time, last registration is from 2008, and not maintained, but looks to need mostly just fluff and buff with some attention to the rig (I have been in touch with Mike Quill) a new sale and a cutlass bearing. We have little information as the sale was from an estate, but think it was a one owner boat. I am informed that the mechanic that winterized the engine with 762 hours thought it was in great shape We did an oil analysis and turned it over in January to confirm so fingers crossed. The cutlass bearing needs replacement, but my boat guy has been unable to cut the coupling from the shaft in order to pull the shat out. The keyway is rusted and the bronze coupling is impossible to cut after 4 hours of trying with a grinder. We were able to unscrew the bolts and connection from the engine. He spoke with a company out of Wisconsin, Kahlenberg that will supply a new shaft for 3-$400. They say because of the age of the shaft should be replaced anyway so just cut the shaft at the coupling and get a new one. Any thoughts on this would be gratefully appreciated.
I am also in need of a new sail ( that was a surprise) and will post questions on that under a separate topic to hopefully be more helpful for future readers. Thanks again
Steve O
Nonsuch 26C #172 ex Cracker Jack/TBD
Marblehead, MA
Congratulations on your purchase, Steve. I don’t know why your guy would try cutting it first as there are various means of removing it from the shaft. Is yours a “VEE” drive??
Joe Valinoti
S/V IL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA
Joe,
Thank you I don’t know. It is a 21 hp. I will ask him. He was cutting the coupling bc the bolts and keyway were rusted and would not budge. What do you think of the advice of a new shaft
If he can get the coupling off, and the shaft is still good, I see no reason to replace it. It needs to be checked for run out (trueness) and wear in the usual spots.
Thanks so very much for replying. He has been trying to cut the coupling. (4 hours) with a grinder tight quarters as you know, no luck and he is afraid he may nick the shaft…maybe he has idk
I sympathize with your guy trying to get the coupling off the shaft. Even with no rust anywhere it was very hard to get the flange off the shaft the first time. In my case it was due to the two little craters raised on the shaft by the set screws. If I had known that I would have removed the setscrews and used a sharp drill bit to clean off these tiny crater ridges.
Instead I pressed the flange off with two bolts, a plate, and some sockets that were less than the shaft diameter, a method suggested by someone else on this list. Slow but it worked.
After cleaning the two bumps off the shaft with a few swipes of a file it slid right back on and off easily.
The coupling on my boat was steel (or cast iron?) Not bronze. Salt water must not like keys because in fresh water my key looks like new. The shaft is stainless, the key is usually carbon steel. Maybe someone who is in salt water would know what the best key material is for salt.
Tom
PS when removing the cutlass bearing remember to first remove the two setscrews on the port side. They will be hiding in paint and or antifouling.
I followed the process Tom used. A metal plate with holes that lined up with the flange, a plain socket slightly smaller than the shaft, and a handful of grade 8 bolts and nuts. Bolt the metal plate behind the shaft flange and place the socket between it and the shaft. Tighten the bolts and as the socket presses on the shaft it will move slowly. Took me all day!
Reinstall was fun. My flange was an “interference fit” I needed to heat the flange and using dry ice I cooled the shaft. To judge when the flange was hot enough I used a wax crayon sold at welding shops for this purpose.
A 2 man job, took two tries to get it in. After it was snug in place I re drilled the Allen key dimples and re wired them when snug.
Have a machine shop check the shaft and ensure that the shaft and flange face are square.
Steve,
If you do the job yourself and time is not an issue try the puller method. Slow but it works. If you have to pay a mechanic the numbers change. While I was working I had more money than time so I hired s yard to install a soft coupler and new cutlass bearing and Dripless seal. The flange was reluctant to come off. At the mechanics rate it would have been cheaper to cut the shaft and pay for a new shaft and flange than to pay for the 5 hours of labour removing the old flange.
Thanks to all for your advice on so many issues. This group is such a wonderful and generous resource So glad I bought a Nonsuch. Update on the shaft... we had to cut it away from the coupling. I just received the new shaft, new coupling, cutlass bearing and repaired prop from Kahlenberg Industries in WI. Since everything else is new I am thinking of putting in a dripless shaft seal and while the prop is off a line cutter. Any thoughts on these would be appreciated. Thank you.
I’ve had boats with dripless shaft seals and boats without. IMHO, with is much better.
I’ve never had a line cutter; not as many lobsterpots out my way as yours. I’ll be interested in the feedback you get on that issue from more knowledgeable sources.
I’ve been using this line cutter for years. It is a combination 1” anode and line cutter for $40. https://www.amazon.com/SALCA-1000-Cutter-Shaft-Patent-Pending/dp/B071KWPV64 As far as the dripless/packing choice, always remember that the packing style can’t cause a catastrophic failure and there’s nothing to remember when launching. Just last week I tightened mine up with a minimum of effort using the wrenches supplied by Hinterhoeller. It’s called Duramax and was installed back in 2013. It’s only the 3rd time in all those years.
Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA
JUST FYI - I’m going through the new prop shaft/coupler with my new engine install.
I asked the marina about putting in a dripless one, and their answer was “dripless - when they work, they work really well; when they fail, they are hard to fix”.
The failure modes are imperfections on the prop shaft, from what I understand. Also, (again, from what I’ve read) some need to ensure water is at the seal interface, which means getting in there on launch to pull back the seal; another thing to do on launch before starting up the motor.
I decided to stick with a packing seal; I have no issue re-doing packing (bit of experience there on other large items) and, figured that this (very successful) shop guys know what they are talking about with boats, while I certainly don’t.
Saying that, lots of people love their dripless shaft seal, so whichever way you go, you’re likely fine.
JohnS NS26C, lying Bath ON,
with new prop shaft and coupling delivered,
I replaced the coupling and cutlass bearing on my 87’ 22. The coupling was beat up from an apparently difficult removal process and the shaft needed straightening. I decided to continue on with the conventional stuffing box with Duramax as there is easy access to adjust when needed and if it needs replacing, it can be done without hauling the boat. Besides when it fails, it will give notice instead of creating a catastrophic situation. The strut appeared to have way more than the necessary offset so I ground it out and found the bolts to be bent, so I’m guessing that it was improperly slung or lifted at some point. The proprietor at the prop shop provided me new bronze bolts. I got the engine back in with new mounts, and the coupler lined up nicely along with the strut. Can’t wait to get this puppy in the water to enjoy her real purpose.
Steve,
La Reina came to me with a PSS dripless shaft seal so I don’t have experience with a stuffing box. I have read that if you over tighten a stuffing box it can cause heat and wear on the prop shaft.
Access to the end of the shaft tube on the 26 is not too bad, if you are not a big man, so having to burp a dripless seal at launch or periodically adjust the stuffing bx should not be a big concern.
There are a number of makes of dripless seals on the market but in North America the PSS sold by PYI seems to be the most popular.
The purchase survey indicated that the cutlass bearing needed to be replaced so in the spring I hauled the boat ans asked the yard to change the bearing. The yard man decided the best way to get the bearing out was to pull the prop shaft. When LA Reina went back in to the water the seal leaked. As part of the PYI system there is a stainless steel doughnut that is held in place by two double sets of set screws. One set of screws hold the doughnut in place and the second set of of screws acts as locks to hold the first set in place. My investigations revealed that the yard man did not know about the two sets of screws. He loosened of the first set and when the seal would not move he beat it off with a hammer. He damaged the face of the doughnut so it no longer sealed properly. The face could have been resurfaced or the doughnut flipped around but a new seal was purchased instead. The moral of this story to make sure anyone you hire to work on the boat knows what they are doing.
Above 12 knots a vacuum is created in the shaft tube that pulls the water away from the seal. If this happens the seal will overheat. The water provides lubrication and cooling so PSS developed a high speed seal that has a water injection spigot on it for use on boats that exceed 12 knots. A line is run from the heat exchanger or the water injection hose for the exhaust to the spigot. This provides a continuous flow of water to the seal when the engine is running.To the best of my knowledge LA Reina has never reached 12 knots through the water, however I have the high speed seal. The hose is plumbed in so that water is injected into the seal hose so burping the the seal at launch is not necessary. When I went to the PYI site it looks like they only sell the high speed seal now and for owners of sailboats they can decide whether to plug the spigot or plumb it in to to the engine cooling system.
I do like the fact that the bilge stays dry. I suspect that if the seal ever fails I will feel differently about it.
