I’m repairing my boat that was on the hard for a number of years (we were separated due to JOB) : (
Unfortunately the gentleman that rigged my boat did not notify me that boot had to go and did not replace the boot with one from Mike (temp solution (image)… he suggested making a custom boot with boot tape (not done at the moment)) … Is anyone using a split boot or something besides the OEM boot? Should I restart the process with the proper boot and shims … thoughts? I noticed some water (moisture) down below not related to the boot (cabin area) is this most likely related to port windows (not sailing) - I’m sure the window seals are gone … can someone recommend parts for NS 30C? Apologize for the random questions - novice onboard!
Hi Jason,
This is a timely question. A few months ago I did a bunch of work on the lower part of my mast and the last remaining bit of it is the boot. (Bob asked me to write it up, but I am waiting until I get the boot back on.)
The old boot that I took off at the start of the project was hideous. Very rough, oxidized, mottled gray with rust stains where the poor quality band clamps had been around it.
Here’s a photo:
I bought a new one to replace it, but it is too small in diameter. My mast is 11-1/4" diameter and the replacement seems to be made for an 11" mast. Here is how it fits on my mast:
You’ll notice that both the old and the new ones are split. My mast has a big Spartite bulge, so even if the mast was removed I would not be able to slide a stock boot into place. So now I’ve ruined the new one, can’t return it, and they aren’t cheap. What to do?
What I did is this. I took out some Bestine solvent (https://www.amazon.com/Bestine-Solvent-Thinner-Rubber-Cement/dp/B006SOK9YY - naphtha would work, too, but be careful with others), and some emery cloth and wet sanded the entire surface of the vinyl down to solid, non-oxidized material. Then I propped it up very carefully so it would sit level and allow dripping all the way around the bottom edge and I sprayed it with Rustoleum vinyl paint. (This stuff in white: https://www.rustoleum.com/product-catalog/consumer-brands/specialty/vinyl-spray - available at Home Depot, Lowe’s, etc.)
I sprayed it on heavy and let it run down the sides and drip off the bottom. Usually you spray light coats of spray paint and build slowly, but in this case I didn’t want the solvents to evaporate off, I wanted them to remain long enough to penetrate into the old vinyl and essentially “weld” the new layer onto the old. I did this two or three times, letting it almost “dry” each time to get a very heavy build. Then I trimmed the bottom with a sharp knife. (Make sure and give it a few days for the solvents to completely out-gas before messing with it.) And it worked. My old one now looks as white and smooth and shiny as the new one. My paint job is not as perfect as the new molded one, but you can’t tell them apart from a few feet away. I cannot scrape off the new surface with my thumbnail, though time will tell how well it really holds up.
Of course I took it down to the boat last week to put it back on but I couldn’t find the new band clamps that I bought for it three months ago. Story of my life.
It is my intention to drill a small hole in those two tabs where I’m holding it in the photo. I’ll put some white Sikaflex in the joint and between those tabs, put on the band clamps, and then put a small nut/bolt in the hole to hold the tabs together. I think a bit of waxed paper backing beneath the joint will keep the Sikaflex off of the stainless deck ring and if I’m careful it will look better than the original one did.
Now, what is the diameter of your mast? I don’t know if the mast on a 30C is the same as on a 33. If you think it will fit, I have the new one available that was too small for mine…
Many years back I had to replace the mast-boot on my 30U, but the mast was in. I purchased the proper boot from Mike Quill, and then split the boot vertically, carefully worked it around the mast, taped the vertical split, and then taped the top and bottom (over the giant hose clamp) edges with boot-tape. Hasn’t leaked since.
As far as the portholes are concerned, I recently removed all of the caulking from the exterior of each porthole, cleaned of all debris, and then laid in a new bead of Life-Caulk on both the outer and innner seams of the portholes. I have done this a few times over the last 20 years and it works well to keep the water out for several years. I may have used 3M 4200 (the UV resistant, non-permanent caulk) once or twice with the same result. DO NOT use 5200! 5200 is only for permanent bonding, and more than difficult to remove.
Peter Grabow
S/V CAKE WALK III
1987 30U 430
Jersey City, NJ
Mike Quill suggested heating, but then retracted when I explained that there was a rather thick Spartite band around the mast and that I wouldn’t spend the thousands of dollars to remove and replace the mast just to put on a boot, anyway. It apparently works well for those who remove their masts every winter and use wedges. In fact, when you consider the cost of a new boot, it almost seems like a good maintenance practice to remove the boot every ten years and do the restoration like I did. It only costs a few dollars and an hour or two of time, depending on how bad the oxidation is. That vinyl paint really is made of actual vinyl and the boot seems to come out almost like new. A new boot costs over $260.
Also, in case Jason missed it the first time around, I do have that new boot which didn’t fit my mast diameter. It’s hard to measure a floppy circle, but it looks to be about 11-1/16 to 11-1/8 inches.
To me. this product that Mike suggests is the absolute best answer, for many good reasons. Start at the bottom and tape up and the overlap will shed the water.
Roger, the mast boot is a rubber or plastic collar around the mast at deck level to keep water out. On my boat I put a canvas skirt over it to keep the sun UV from destroying it. Sorry no pictures.
Don
Re: moisture. My 30c which I bought last year, had the cushions getting wet. I traced it up to the upper grab rail, or whatever you would call that rail just below the windows. I read about the seal around the window. It wasn’t that. It turned out to be leaking from the grab rails on the deck.the teak bases were acting as a scupper and the rain would go through the screw holes, inside the headliner and through the interior grab rail, then down the wall to the cushions I ended up removing the screws from inside the headliner and taking the deckhouse grab rails off. I chamfered the holes and put a ring of butyl tape around the hole. The idea is to flatten the butyl into the hole, but only during the last couple turns. If it gets in the hole to soon, it’s a pain to turn the screw. You’ll also need a second person to push down. This has cured the problem. But, the grab rail is thin after all these years. I’ll replace next year with a raised g-10 base so rain water can’t get in.
Ernie,
Thanks for the photos. It looks like your boot is clamped with a stainless clamp and also taped. I see stains in some of the photos other boots in this thread that indicate they were also clamped.
It’s our first season with Soave. My boot isn’t clamped or taped. ( Photo Here ) and ( HERE ) . I’m thinking a clamp might be redundant if I used the right tape to seal it and protect it from UV.
It already fits snugly enough that I didn’t realize the clamp was missing till I saw photos of other boats. Thoughts ?
Thanks,
Rob Cohen
s/v SOAVE
NS33 #009
Westport, CT
I use 2 clamps (to keep the water out - they are essential and part of the original design and spec). The tape is mostly for appearance and to keep the extra length of the steel band on each clamp “under control” and not sticking out and tripping me up.
Thanks Ernie and everyone for sharing photos and insight. Very helpful for new a Nonsuch owner like myself.
I see the logic of clamp and tape. I’m lucky to have a nearly new boot on Soave… would have been nice if it was clamped but that is easy to remedy. Looks like riterig.com is a good source.
My mast circumference about 35" so I’ll get a couple 28-38" clamps.
I’ll have about 3" excess clamp band. Would you suggest I shorten the clamp so that there is less excess once it’s tightened or is better to leave the excess so there is more surface area for the tape to hold it down?
The boot covers the mast (which has a smaller circumference than the hole in the casting for the mast to fit into. So … the boot SHOULD be shaped “bigger on the bottom than on the top” meaning … that the clamp on the TOP should be somewhat shorter than the clamp on the bottom of the boot. Do check this out. I would not cut or “modify” the clamp - yikes !!! As you point out, the longer the “tabs”, the easier to tape down. I would budget a third of a roll of of 3/4" WHITE vinyl 3M plain old electrician’s tape to wrap around and around the whole she-bang to simply keep it all together and neat looking. I have a feeling that you store the boat on the hard and, maybe, the mast comes down yearly. I dunno. In any case, this tape lasts and lasts and does the job nicely and is WAY cheaper than “boat tape”. A regular roll of this 3M tape will run you a few bucks. Available in Home Depot, etc. or, of course, an electrical supply store.
I’ve attached a close-up shot of my mast boot. Note the 2 different length clamps poking out of the tape.
Hi Ernie,
Thanks for your patience in helping me gasp the mast boot here on Soave. I took your advice to physically measure the mast boot circumference. At the top I measured 36" which isn’t a surprise because the thickness of the boot adds to the circumference. The bottom measures 44.5" which is larger than the largest clamp available from riterig.com.
The really curious thing is that it looks like someone trimmed the bottom of the boot. When I measure from the bottom of the boot to the taper I get ± 1/8" all the way around and the bottom edge isn’t clean like it come out of a mold. Why ?
When I slide the boot down my mast wedges which are 1.25" higher than the top lip of the cast mast collar hit the tapered part of the boot and stop it from sliding down when there is a about 1/8"- 1/4" of overlap of boot and collar.
Photo 1 shows the boot up and the bottom of the mast wedges sitting on the mast collar. In the picture there is a horizontal stain at about 2.25" and the top of the collar is at 2.75 ".
The second photo shows the mast collar down and still not even with the horizontal stain. The boot is a little shy of a quarter of an inch overlapping the mast collar.
I doubt this would be enough to get a clamp to secure without slipping off the top of the collar..
“The really curious thing is that it looks like someone trimmed the bottom of the boot. When I measure from the bottom of the boot to the taper I get ± 1/8” all the way around and the bottom edge isn’t clean like it come out of a mold. Why ?"
According to what Mike Quill told me a few months ago, they form the vinyl sheet over a form or mandrel and then trim it to specs by hand. It’s just vinyl and when warm is easily sliced with a knife. But hand work on something that will never be seen in its entirety once installed is apparently not done with a lot of precision.
