On backing in to one's slip

Better to start a new thread on this topic.

I guess that I am in hot water for “discouraging sailing skills”. (Possibly, I’m also in trouble for suggesting that the gorgeous Chester and south shore area of Nova Scotia has no wind. )

My “no wind” reference was simply making a connection to backing a Nonsuch (or any boat) into a slip while dealing with wind, gusts, etc.

The truth is that there are several perfectly good reasons why some of us do not want to end up, stern in, at our slips. Aside from moments of sheer terror that may arise from a gust of wind, it just might be easier (or neater) to have the boat tied up, bow in. Perhaps, it’s easier to leap off and hold the beast in place, if you dock, bow in. Or, depending on where your shore power connects to both boat and shore, it might be better to be bow in. Or. like me, maybe you want to relax in your cockpit away from the main spline (and all of the traffic) while you are reading, staring out into space, looking at something (or someone) out in open water or checking out your neighbours, across the water, at the next line of docks. You just don’t feel like being on display to the world going by. Kind of like prefering to sit out on your rear deck at home as opposed to the front porch.

And, likely, there are lots of other reasons.

I cannot disagree with the notion that we are all better off if we are comfortable (and have practicedI the fine art of backing in. This endeavour falls into the same general category as gybing a Nonsuch. Very do-able and nice to be comfy with but … maybe not the best approach, under certain circumstances.

Ernie A. in Toronto

Ernie,
I suspect that, like me, you are often in hot water and not just when we post on this forum.

I agree with your listed reasons for going in bow first. La Reina’s home slip is a bow in port tie. This works with the prop walk and means I don’t have to vault over the mainsheet winch when I step onto the dock to tie up. Stern in would require clearing the winch. My first slip in the marina had up to 5 knots of cross current which made for some exciting docking if I came back at max flow. The prevailing winds at my current slip try to blow me off the dock however the current is seldom above 1 knot.

I have found that La Reina backs up very nicely but I have not yet mastered the cross wind while in reverse. Maybe I am not brave enough to enter my slip with sufficient speed to keep the bow from blowing off.

A friend of mine owned a 36 for a couple of years. He was and still is a very experienced sailor. At the time he bought the 36 he also owned a J35 and a San Juan 24. He had not owned the 36 long when he asked my about backing into the slip with a cross wind. I told him I did not have an answer but that some people used more speed to maintain steerage. He said he tried everything he could think of to no avail. He said his boat neighbour became rather excited as my backed toward the slip at about 5 knots (possibly a slight exaggeration). He said the bow still blew off and he had to bailout.

I seem to recall that Cedric is a master mariner who captains large vessels as far away as the Antarctic. Joe is a vastly more experienced sailor and Nonsuch sailor than I (me?) and I believe was a delivery captain for some time so I hope they will come out to British Columbia to the kindergarten of sailing and give me some docking lessons. I will provide the boat and beer.

Mark Powers

Mark -

The only time that I am NOT in hot water is when I’m siling (and that is because Lake Ontario is not heated). We are fortunate to have some of these truly experienced master sailors and craftspeople (Cedric, Joe, Paul Miler, etc.) in our midst because, otherwise, who, on earth, would we be able to razz and joke about ??

We all know that when the bottom drops out, we can run to these folks (in a panic) and they’ll bail us out (figuratively speaking, that is).

Seriously, this is a heck of a good group. That said, I won’t be backing into my slip anytime soon.

Ernie A. in Toronto

One problem I have here, some times, where there are 99% slips and hardly any mooring balls is short finger piers. If I go bow in, this 82 year old has trouble getting off the high bow on to low docks.
Hate to rub it in, my Canadian friends, but we raced today in 15 to 20 out of the NE and about 60 deg F.

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

I have similar issues, though apparently without quite as much fuss getting over the mizzen sheet (which is well behind the cockpit). In my case, the admiral is none too graceful getting on and off, and needs to go through the gates in the lifelines rather than over the tops. Therefore, with my small finger docks (careful, there…) in my home slip, I must go stern in. Most of the other boats in my marina do so as well, so I’m not in the minority here.

On the advice of a mentor, I do try to go a couple of days at the beginning of the season where I just waft about the marina under reverse power, and practice backing in.

Brian
SV Serenity
Nonsuch Nereus #003
Pax River, MD

I understand now Joe. You have incentive to learn how to back in.

Last race of the polar Bear series was March 20. Wind 6 to 15 knots, light rain and temp cold. Most of the crew had to go below to dry out and warm up.

Wednesday, winds 5 to 10 knots, sun shining and temp very comfortable. A couple of other boats out there to play with. Today sun light winds, temp above 50 F. Stuck in the garden.

Brian,
Are you suggesting practice could help improve my reverse docking?

The First Sea Lord says there is no help for me, but I will give it a try when I have some fearless crew prepared to act as self launching fenders.

Mark Powers

Good Morning,

The “backing in” subject has surfaced a few times in the past and that’s a good thing. I have learned so very much from this forum over the years and have benefitted from the wisdom of others. In the case of the “backing in” subject, I see the varied view points and understand that each skipper must make their very own decisions based on what they think they know. Please allow me to offer my thoughts. I’ve been told by friends that I am entitled to my very own ridiculous opinions.

I previously owned a NS 22, Whiskers and now own a NS 30 Whiskers II. I parked Whiskers bow in. My NS 22 allowed me to exit the boat from just about any point on the boat which made it possible to put up with a short finger pier. It was not the safest thing to do as I had to step over safety cable and wait till the boat could be swung over closer to the finger pier. Not knowing any difference at the time, this was not a big deal. Although, I was younger then.

Now, I own Whiskers II, my wonderful NS 30. I remember bringing her to Solomons from the Chester River, 70 miles North, in a 35 mph broad reach run on a 45 degree day and put her bow in to my slip. My crew and I had nasty time getting off that boat. We were cold, tired and it turned dark on us. Of course we figured out how to depart. Went sailing shortly after and realized that this is not going to work safely. It’s downright dangerous, and takes the fun out of boating. Not being able to find another marina with long finger piers I decided that I must learn to back in. My first step was to ask every single sail boater that was stern in, on my dock for advice. In every case no one knew how to back in other than the bumper car method. Some would get the stern in the area and do the rest by pulling on piling lines. I decided not to do that and that I was still young enough to learn. I thought about going to a sailing school or hiring someone to teach me. This was in 2016 and at the time I was 75 and now Whiskers II and I still have a close relationship.

Here’s what I did, I went to You Tube and found these sites: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGMAEjiHmU&t=51s and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qOPM_SMJCc&t=8s . There are a bunch of other videos on sailboat docking stern in.

The first thing I learned was the “standing turn” (called something else in other places). I highly recommend that every one learns how to do this. This skill will not only help you back in but can get you out of some unique predicaments. I would take the boat out many quiet mornings by myself and just practiced, practiced, and practiced. I just practiced the standing turn and did not try backing into my slip. Oh, maybe a couple of times. Then I waited till I had more wind and practiced even more. Then waited till I had lots of wind and did the same. This process allowed me to learn that I now had some control over the boat and not the boat over me. Using the information in the aforementioned videos I then started learning how to back the boat in. Did I screw up? You can bet I did. Did I get mad and say bad words? You bet I did. Did I give up? Nope.. I learned to do this on nice days but graduated into heavier wind days.

It’s a fool’s paradise to only learn how to use these boats in nice weather. The ability to learn these things whether you’re stern in or not will help to feel good about your authority over the boat and as well will enhance safety with your sailing experience.

The more I learned allowed me to learn even more. Let me tell you what I do now. I know this is long and you’re getting tired of me but hang in for a short while. It became obvious that one of my fears was going too fast in reverse and not being able to stop the boat. So the next thing for me to practice was to go out in the open water, using an existing float in the water and practice backing towards that float with the intention of learning when to start putting the brakes on. I did this enough times that using reverse, neutral and forward gave an opportunity to have more control over the boat. One will learn that you can’t steer these boats going in reverse at a slow speed. I now go some distance from my slip, put the boat in reverse and speed up. At first there is no steering control and the boat may be going in a direction that you did not want but soon you will feel steering kick in. You will have to play with the throttle to find the best speed. Once I have steering control, I stand on the other side of the wheel and drive her like a car. This may not work for all because of throttle and shift location. Since the boat now will steer and I am feel comfortable with speed control, I simply drive her into the slip. At first, I had crew immediately place the spring lines in the event I could not stop the boat. But that never happened. Now I don’t want crew pulling on any lines as a wrong pull negates all of your steering. They can catch the lines but don’t pull on them.

In some previous mailings the wind effect was of concern and a concern it should be. For example, if the wind is broad side to my slip I come at an angle (maybe 45 degrees pointing toward the wind) and as I approach my slip, I adjust speed accordingly and let the wind slowly position the bow as I am still going in reverse. As others mentioned earlier, practice, practice and practice.

I think the most important thing to learn is to know that when things are not going as planned, just abandon that attempt. Simply put her in forward gear and get the heck out of there and then just try it again. An example: a couple of weeks ago while doing the maneuver just mentioned, in a heavy gusty wind (had sailed with double reef) as I approached my slip and just feet before the pilings I was hit with gust that took me out of position causing direct aim at the piling. I learned enough to know that I should not make any attempt to salvage that attempt and to simply put her in forward, put the pedal to the medal and get out of there. I made a second attempt with the same result and had a nice landing on the third attempt. Whatever you do, do not worry about what the people on shore are thinking. The hell with them.

There is so much more to learn and I am sure I will screw up from time to time but using the above mentioned videos makes my sailing adventures most relaxing. I no longer fear bad weather returns to my slip although knowing that caution is always prudent. Because I am relaxed, my crew and guests are also relaxed. I hope I don’t get too much hate mail over this but as I said before, my friends tell me I am entitled to my very own ridiculous opinion.

Have a good sailing year.

Cheers,

Butch

Butch Garren

Nonsuch 30 #196 “Whiskers II”

SIYC Slip 12

Solomons, MD

I’m glad Bruce mentioned the use of spring lines, . When backing into my slip, my crew knows that they should disregard all other lines and focus on the springs. If they do this, I just keep the boat in reverse and it will line itself up in the slip. They then attach bow and stern lines. Also, when the wind is strong on my port bow, I will go past my slip, turn around and approach from the other direction to take advantage of that wind. This is due to prop walk. Not all situations are the same and as Bruce said, don’t be afraid to try again.

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

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Points very well taken, Butch (or is it Bruce ???)

Good letter, sir. Good to hear from you. I launch at the end of April (maybe in a blizzard ?) and will promptly practice some of these moves.

Take care, bud.

Ernie A. in Toronto

In the great white north rubbing it in can lead to “deux minutes pour avoir donné de la bande” et cinq minute pour rudess"

Mark,

I am indeed suggesting that practice makes you less prone to make mistakes (because then you meant to do it that way!) and more comfortable doing it. Obviously (other thread), you want to practice when wind and tide are not too adverse, but as you get better you’ll be more comfortable in slightly stiffer weather.*

*note: this is what has been relayed to me. I go out and practice, but either I’m not practicing enough or I’m not a fast learner, because each time still seems like a nearly impossible task.

My mentor suggested one way to practice is to drop a couple of fenders (weighted slightly if you can) wider then boat width, then practice running around backing between the fenders. My marina has a large area to practice in (they teach the ASA 101 course in that same area), so I just use one of the markers and toss one of my own. In theory I should be able to back between them, but in practice, it is still nerve wracking.

Also, I don’t advocate using my neighboring boat to bounce into or out of my slip, because I like him. :slight_smile:

Brian
SV Serenity
Nonsuch Nereus #003
Pax River MD

I am quite confident that I can go astern with reasonable precision provide I can maintain reasonable steerage way, that means 2 - 3 knots in anything more than light airs, and I’m happy to do that with plenty of sea room. Backing onto a finger slip at 2 - 3 knots is pretty much guaranteed to raise tension in the wheelhouse, even if I do as Joe suggests and move the gear selector to neutral. It’s just cultivates matrimonial serenity if we go bows in.

Alan Steward
30C 144 MagnifiCat

Someone told me about attaching a line off the outer pile, securing as you would a spring line and reverse and stern will head right into the slip. I think I got right, or someone can clarify. I have a 26 Ultra in Annapolis and need to back in which is a challenge. Going to try the above soon. Richard
Swell
26U

I was told a line off a piling as if a stern springline when secured and boat put in reverse will bring the stern into the slip effectively. I will try it soon. Richard Swell 26U Annapolis

Richard,

I suggest you go to You Tube site https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGMAEjiHmU&t=34s and find time location on that video: 1:18:30. That is around the point that discussion of the Waterman’s Spring Line start.

You may find it very helpful for the backing in procedure you wrote about.. The whole video is worth watching.

Cheers,

Butch

Butch Garren

Nonsuch 30 #196 “Whiskers II”

SIYC Slip 12

Solomons, MD

Richard,

I suggest you go to You Tube site https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGMAEjiHmU&t=34s and find time location on that video: 1:18:30. That is around the point that discussion of the Waterman’s Spring Line start.

You may find it very helpful for the backing in procedure you wrote about.. The whole video is worth watching.

Cheers,

Butch

Butch Garren

Nonsuch 30 #196 “Whiskers II”

SIYC Slip 12

Solomons, MD

Richard,

I suggest you go to You Tube site https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoGMAEjiHmU&t=34s and find time location on that video: 1:18:30. That is around the point that discussion of the Waterman’s Spring Line start.

You may find it very helpful for the backing in procedure you wrote about.. The whole video is worth watching.

Cheers,

Butch

Butch Garren

Nonsuch 30 #196 “Whiskers II”

SIYC Slip 12

Solomons, MD