Composting Head from Julie & Lloyd

[system]

Lloyd - without pictures it’s just a fable ;>) we need pics!

Joe
Sea Horse
1985 26C #156

Composting Head (change of subject)

We have had an Airhead on our 30U since 2010 (just pulled our receipt - 2/22/10 purchase for $1004, including shipping). We needed to build a small platform to give us a stable base to mount the unit, and have carried a small step-stool to make it easier for those who are height challenged to use the unit. We vented the unit through the Dorado box over the shower, putting a solar fan on the box instead of hard-wiring the pancake fan that the unit came with. We removed the pancake fan so it did not hinder airflow. This winter I am going to drill a hole through the wall between shower and head to run the exhaust hose through the wall and get it out of the way. (I considered running PVC piping, but decided there would be too many hard turns that would decrease the airflow too much - if anyone knows better, I would love to hear from you.)

We created an instruction plaque that mounts exactly where the WC plaque mounted. Even printed it on green paper to match the old WC plaque and then sealed it in plastic. I can share if anyone is interested.

With two people aboard, we need to empty the fluids container every other day. If the wind is real brisk, we try not to sail with the tank more than 1/2 filled (it will leak otherwise while heeled over hard). Leakage was a big problem, corrected for the most part by a new spring Airhead sent us. Seals much better.

When we removed the old WC, tank and pump, We also removed 47 hose clamps. While I never really worried about them, I was shocked by the number of clamps and the potential for a problem. We also removed the smelly hoses and tank. The Airhead only smells if you leave the liquids go too long before emptying - do it at least once a week when it is hot out. It is the liquids that tend to smell, not the solids which dry out fairly quickly.

Last summer while on a week long cruise, we broke the hinges on the toilet seat. Not something I thought to carry a spare of. It is a marine seat, which is smaller that a home seat. Fortunately, I found a home seat at a hardware store with identical hinges, swapped the hinges and tossed the brand new seat and lid (seemed very wasteful tossing it, but what else was I to do with it). The cruise could continue.

We freed up considerable space - enough for a few cases of beer, or I suppose batteries, but beer is more fun.

I have pictures if anyone wants to see.

lloyd herman
Rendezvous, 30U
Port Washington, NY

• show quoted text -

[Ed11 (Ed)]

Here’s a few pix I took several years ago aboard a NS30 near St Petersburg, FL. The owner had just finished installation and was very satisfied with his work.
A year later I met with him and his wife to get their impressions of the conversion. Both were entirely pleased and reported no problems with the system.

Ed Strazzini
PELICAN, NS33 #36
Deltaville, VA

[system]

PVC pipe, the turns make no measurable difference in air flow, the pressure is very low. Ours runs back to the aft locker. We use the muffin fan that came with it power draw is not worth talking about. Our experience mirrors yours, we get about 4 - 5 weeks / charge on the main tank. No issues on the leaking but that tank needs to be properly engaged.

No odour, quiet and no more holding tank…

[system]

Another photo of an AirHead on a 26C. A 2 gallon tank, crank handle must be on the stbd side and there looks like a home made sight glass on the tank.

Tom

[user43]

Lloyd’s “fable” may be just a fable … but it’s a clear, concise, caring and warmly written one.

Ernie A. in Toronto

[system]

There is another composting head on the market, ideal for sailboats, that I didn’t see mentioned on this thread yet. C-HEAD. http://c-head.com/ . Look at their Shorty model. Somewhat different mechanics on this, a bit more economical and more compact than Airhead or Nature’s Head. I looked at all of these brands for other projects, most recently for a fit-out of a MacGregor 26M which has much less space in the head compartment than any Nonsuch. While I opted for a porta potty for this winter’s southern cruise (via trailer to Florida) on the MacGregor I heard from a number of other Mac owners who are very pleased with their C-Heads. From C-Head website you can contact the company owner/inventor of this head directly for an engaging discussion.

I’ve attached a pic of the Shorty model installed in a MacGregor 26M (not ours). And a pic of our Mac, called Holiday. We are presently living aboard for the winter, sailing from Punta Gorda. No snow here.

Best regards to all,
Greg Silver
Misty Cat 26C #121
St. Peter’s, Cape Breton

(attachments)

[system]

Our Nonsuch 26 had a “recirculating” head from Monomatic, a 1970’s idea for RVs that are no longer in production. (google “monomatic toilet” to see what we had)

Was thinking about a composting head, but went with a Raritan small model, simply because the Monomatic needed a step ladder for the wife to use, and getting into any of the lockers in the 26 head with this Monomatic Monstrosity was a bit of an issue.

New holding tank and compact head being put in this winter.

We have Peggy Hall’s Boat owners’ septic system book, which makes a lot of sense in terms of head odors and how the whole thing works.

Time will tell if it was a good decision or not!

JohnS, NS26C 046, in Bath ON. awaiting winter/early spring work.

[Bill_Baxter]

I was reminded by Greg’s post on the C-Head (that included a photo of Holiday, his boat in Punta Gorda) of the often-quoted story of Walter Cronkite’s boat, apparently Assignment, used by Roger Mudd and other replacement news anchors in “Walter is not with us tonight, he’s on assignment”, a CBS in-joke. I cannot confirm that Water ever had a boat named other than Wyntje, but it still is a good story.

Bill Baxter
Persistence NS30 #507
Penetang, ON

[system]

thank you, Ernie. Knew there was a reason why I liked Toronto (except when the Leaf’s beat my Sabres, being an old Buffalo boy).

For those looking for pictures, it appears other have supplied such already. For those interested in our Airhead operating instructions, I attach them.

lloyd herman
Rendezvous, 30U
Port Washington, NY

Tom S. - the sight tube on the tank in the photo you supplied is how the unit came from the factory. Can get a bit yucky looking. We clean the tank at the end of the season with real hot water (dissolves all of the salts that otherwise build up inside the tank) and while doing that, slide the tube off while it is nice and hot and clean the inside with a Q-tip. Heat it back up again and it slides back in place.

(attachments)

AIRHEAD OPERATING INSTRUCTIONS.doc (24 KB)

[user43]

I adore Buffalo - city with a heart (and some pretty scary weather).

Ernie A. in Toronto

On Friday, February 14, 2020 at 3:36:04 PM UTC-5, Julie & Lloyd on Rendezvous wrote:

[user24]

The need to empty the urine bucket every couple of days is one of the things holding me back from installing a composting head. (Otherwise they sound like a terrific option–especially the increased beer locker space possibilities.) How/where do folks with composting heads empty the urine bucket? In a marina (that seems to defeat the “getting off the grid” purpose), multiple tanks, over the side, something else? And for those that travel the ICW, has there been any problems with authorities? I’ve heard second hand anecdotal stories in Annapolis.

Jim Cosgrove
FATE 30U #343
Galesville, MD

[Dale_Myrfield]

Hey Jim, you sure stopped that thread! Nobody wants to admit dumping urine overboard. It strikes me that if one is willing to do that, it would be much easier to build a little urine catching weir in the “51” and diamond drill a urine drain in the forward part of the head and lead it to the sink thru hull. This would be similar to the urine shelf on a composter. A petcock in the line could prevent dumping in say a marina, but urine is virtually sterile. Note the flush would rinse this line and bowl. From past experience on lake Superior in 1997 (with virtually no pump out facilities) peeing in a pail gave us over 3X head capacity. If you’re going to dump it why not make it easy…and avoid the situation where the Admiral almost dumped a bucket-full on a kayaker I was chatting with alongside our boat! And of course much easier solids handling. Now inspections may be a different matter, but how does a composter answer the obvious question?

We think…O Lord, the lake is so large and my bladder so small! Unfortunately with 100,000 of us and the fertilizer in our pee…“Human urine can cause eutrophication because it contains chemicals such as nitrogen and phosphorus” this is somewhat self defeating for us fresh water sailors.

So, Jim’s question remains…" How/where do folks with composting heads empty the urine bucket?"

Dale Myrfield

Duck Soup

NS 30U 382
Collins Bay On

[system]

Hmmm. Having a little hose connecting the head to the sink drain might raise a few red flags with the authorities in the great lakes. Better to avoid any hard wired connections like that.

I think the answer may be over the side only when there are no other options. At a dock or near a public washroom there is always a place to dump the bucket. Near shore at anchor I guess a trip to the beach along with all the dog runners could work.
Or like Jim suggested, a second, larger “temporary” container.
We could also ask the powerboaters from Quebec with six adults aboard, anchored at Beckwith for a week in July with stacks of beer how they do it. They have solved the problem somehow.

Also, Jim mentioned a possible issue with composting heads and the authorities on the ICW. Does my future 1 gallon bucket meet the regulations? How to get around that?

Eutrophicaton is a problem all over the great lakes and should be taken seriously.

Tom

[Dale_Myrfield]

“Or like Jim suggested, a second, larger “temporary” container” sounds a lot like our present black water tank. So just pipe the pee to the pump-out tank. However this would only give the hard pressed cruiser maybe 17 user days rather than 35. We two needed 2 weeks on Superior.

Dale Myrfield

Duck Soup

NS 30U 382
Collins Bay On

[system]

Well, we have been known to empty overboard in a pinch, but normally take the unit home to dump in the toilet. A few times I have dumped at marinas or yacht club bathrooms, but it can be a bit smelly and so I try to pick off hours to do such. But if I am in the middle of Long Island Sound, and can barely see land, . . . .

And those powerboaters from Quebec, they just go swimming!

lloyd herman
Rendezvous, 30U
Port Washington, NY

[system]

I have finished the new vent installation for our Airhead. For those who like pictures with their fables, here they are.

I used 1 1/2" PVC piping for the whole installation, based upon advise from the list that there would be minimal airflow loss. I painted the PVC so it matches the counters throughout the boat. The 90 degree elbow that goes into the fitting that attaches to the ceiling of the head is bedded in silicon (I had an open tube) and the rest of the installation is simply press fitted. I plan on slipping a rubber door stop under the forward end of the lower horizontal tube to support it. If the pieces come apart, I will glue them. To attach the hose to the PVC pipes, I had to buy a female threaded fitting (the only part I needed to buy) that I was able to thread the hose into. The hose attaches to the Airhead in the normal manner, but the Airhead needs to be loosened from its base to do such. A very minor problem.

I like how this all looks compared to how everything looked before. It will look even better when the shower curtain is back in place. Hopefully it functions as well as the hose did before.

Lloyd Herman
Rendezvous, 30U
Port Washington, New York

(attachments)

[system]

Check out Good Old Boat this month for a good review of the various composting toilet products. Nice install Lloyd.

On Monday, May 4, 2020 at 2:22:54 PM UTC-7, Julie & Lloyd on Rendezvous wrote:

[system]

If a person was not looking to free up space, I thought plumbing the urine pipe into the old holding tank would give a few extra days depending on your beer intake. Holding tank about 90 litres, beer, .355 litres = 253.5 beers or about 5 days for a two person crew.

Mark Powers
La Reina 26C
Vancouver, B.C.

[user69]

When I was scouting 26s a few years ago I looked at one in Gulfport, FL which had a very neat looking C-Head installed. The owner declared himself completely satisfied with it. I’m thinking of replacing the Jabsco on Leda this summer with a C-Head (assuming Vermont ever reopens).

Julian Smith
Leda
N26C
Shelburne, VT

[Ron_Weber]

I have used a C-Head shorty non-churning model for several years, and have been completely satisfied. I selected the non-churning model because our cruising is usually less than two weeks, and it gets emptied after each trip. We have never reached the full capacity in the solids collection bucket, and I usually empty the urine container once a day. Initially I did not install a vent system, and to test the viability of that practice I left it for about two weeks, and as a result, I installed the vent system. I suspect the churning model may be better at absorbing the excess moisture. I have removed the holding tank and head from my recent acquisition in preparation for a new C-Head install. The reasons: no more wasting time going to a marina with a pump out and associated problems, no more odor problems in the boat, no more carrying around a tank full of sewage and not knowing for sure when it is full, in addition, I rebuilt the area that contained the holding tank to make room for up to 3 portable water containers of 7 gallons each to increase my water capacity to 35 gallons for long trips. When I installed a vent system on the previous C-Head, I followed the instructions on their web site and used two computer fans, which proved to be quiet and consumed a minimum of power. Never had any condensation problems since.

As far as dumping urine overboard, I don’t have a problem with that and to this issue I have included a link to some information on that topic. https://www.businessinsider.com/is-it-ok-to-pee-in-the-ocean-2014-8

Ron
N22 #47
Punta Gorda Fl.