Discourse Update and Dyneema Conversation

Newsgroups Archive Prior to 2025
1

Good Evening,

The fourth Update on the Discourse evaluation goes through using mailing list mode. It covers setting up and using Discourse via email posts (with lots of screenshots) and points out one area where Discourse is a little better than Google if you’re using email.

https://n26-115-233.discourse.group/t/update-4-using-discourse-via-email-a-walk-through/158

I have also started a discussion topic on using dyneema

https://n26-115-233.discourse.group/t/using-dyneema-on-a-nonsuch/164

It has a general overview after which I’ve copied in a few recent posts from our Google group on its use. I am really hoping that several people with experience or opinions on using dyneema will request an account and contribute to this topic. Just send a note to my email.

Maybe after we’ve collected some success stories we could create a wiki post on this.

Thanks - be well,
Jon Lewit
N26C #115 - Inua - Kingston, NY
jonlewit@gmail.com

2

I’ve just commissioned a conversion of my choker arrangement from turning blocks to dyneema and low-friction rings.

Those two are very closely related.

When it’s complete, I’ll post it to the Discourse Dyneema discussion. It may be a few weeks because my rigger caught the flu the day after accepting the job.

– Bob
Me Gusta
Nonsuch e26U #233

3

Forgot to mention in the preceding post – the summary that Jon generated from previous discussions is very interesting and useful.

It illustrates a capability that the Google Discussion Group currently doesn’t give us – to cull out “the best of” posts from multiple discussion threads and combine them into a document that collects good advice on a topic.

As a direct substitute for the Google Discussion Group, the tradeoffs between Google and Discourse are kind of break-even (which favors Google since staying where we are takes no extra effort on anyone’s part).

However, these added-value capabilites and the greater ease of getting and maintaining them via Discourse are what make looking at Discourse interesting to consider.

I hope more people will take a look and provide feedback.

– Still Bob
Still Me Gusta
Still Nonsuch e26U #233

4

I don’t have any problem with what we have now. KISS!!

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

5

I agree with Joe. I’ve spent a month participating in the Nonsuch Discourse test group and honestly prefer reading our discussions on Google Groups.

Jon’s idea to copy discussions from Google to Discourse was excellent. I makes it easy to compare the same conversations on the Discourse platform.

Hats off to Jon for his hard work on this.

I encourage anyone interested, give Discourse a try, and form your own opinion. I’m interested to hear what others think.

FWIW, The simplicity of Google makes it easier ( for me ) to focus on the conversations and the people. I love sailing, working on sailboats, and talking to others that feel the same. A more sophisticated platform doesn’t impress me as much as having knowledgable and experienced Nonsuch owners to talk with.

I’m inclined to follow the sailors with the most Nonsuch experience… at the moment that are on Google.

I understand why some prefer Discourse, but in my opinion it didn’t offer enough benefit to warrant the cost ( mostly of migrating to a new platform ).

Migration in nature is amazing. Cape May Point, NJ is a popular place observe monarch butterfly migration because they congregate on the point waiting for the right wind to cross the Delaware Bay. I’ve been lucky enough to see them a couple times over the last decade.

It is amazing to watch the Monarchs congregate on the point and finally take flight in the right wind, but a little sad to see the ones left behind.

The Vanishing Flights of the Monarch Butterfly | The New Yorker

Rob
s/v SOAVE
NS33 #009
Cedar Point YC
Westport, CT

6

Rob,

You have put in a lot of work on Discourse and I understand your concerns and, of course, your preferences. And I agree, of course, that people should take a look for themselves.

Since we seem to have lapsed into a brief comparison of Discourse and GG, and since the overwhelming majority of the group did not read Update #4, I want to advise people of something I discovered. If one thing that you like about GG is that you can scroll down the latest email to see previous comments, you should be advised that the thread in the email may not be (often is not) complete. If you really want to review the full thread, you need to go into Google Groups. As I wrote in the Update last Wednesday -

There is one difference - in Discourse, only the text that you wrote in your reply goes into your post, and therefore out in the email. However, the full thread is a click away by hitting the Visit Topic button.

Before you say, "I like it better in Google where all of the previous posts are right there in the email, you should notice that they aren’t. What you see in Google’s email to you is based on the previous email client settings (whether to include the current email in your reply) and whether people are replying to the last post or an earlier one. If you look at the last email from a couple of recent threads -

  • in Sail Track Replacement, Butch’s posting included 8 previous replies, but the thread on Google had a total of 12
  • in Keel Bolt Question, Rob’s post included 5 replies, but Google showed the thread had 13 posts.

OK - no more from me.

Be Well All,
Jon Lewit

7

Good point Jon. Good to also check out new and ongoing conversations on Discourse.

There are some new conversations on the Discourse test site worth checking out.

Anyone interested should have a read and post a reply.

Rob
s/v SOAVE
NS33 #009
Cedar Point YC
Westport, CT

8

Pros for Discourse:
I really like being able to edit my typos!
It handles pictures and videos better.

Cons for Discourse:
It’s something new to learn and not bothering is easier.

I’ve been checking in on Discourse for a bit now and I do see advantages but it would take time before I felt as comfortable there as I do here. I would be okay with either changing or not but my inner sloth leans toward the status quo.

As for quality of email as a portal to either, IMHO the app is better in both cases. I check GG almost daily and would do the same with Discourse. If you rely on email, I think you miss part of the show in either.

Just my two bits…

Paulm
NS30U Sandpiper
Cowichan Bay B.C.

9

I don’t have to check in anywhere, presently, to see posts since they just arrive in my inbox automatically. The idea of doing something extra does not appeal to me in the least.

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

10

Took me a long time to figure out that some members only read the posts through email. Like Joe. That works great for him. I guess when I signed up years ago that I thought you had to log into the group through your browser to read the posts. Just kept doing that. I keep the tab open, or have a shortcut to open it up again. I do like scrolling down the page and seeing all the topics stacked up, and seeing the dates of the most recent posts. I also understand why I see some post replying a weekly email summary, and other posts that include the complete thread of previous messages. Anyway, all that is to say we all take in the information in different ways. So migrating to Discourse may not be of benefit to all members, and others will thrilled to see a new page. How will the loss of email interaction be mitigated to those who do not want to look at a browser page? Who makes that decision for others or for all?

Respectfully,

Bill Wickett
Info in the from box :slight_smile:

11

I guess I need to reply to this - it just keeps repeating -

Discourse was selected as a possible candidate to replace Google Groups because it allows you to post topics, and reply to other people’s posts, using email. IMHO, going to the site has numerous advantages, but if you want to limit your interaction to email, you can. Please see the last update topic where I cover this with lots of screenshots to let you see what’s going on. Here:

https://n26-115-233.discourse.group/t/update-4-using-discourse-via-email-a-walk-through/158

If you still don’t believe it, please get an account here:

https://n26-115-233.discourse.group/invites/My3ojdHuuM

Set up your profile, select mailing list mode - described step by step here:

https://n26-115-233.discourse.group/t/discourse-at-second-glance-setting-up-your-profile/45

And try it out.

The old Alka-Seltzer commercial — “Try it, you’ll like it”
Maybe not, but at least you’ll know that you can use email.

Be well,
Jon Lewit
N26 #115 - Inua - Kingston, NY

12

I need to correct something in my original post.

I hadn’t noticed a checkbox on the email preferences page and had said that in mailing list mode, Discourse only showed the latest reply. Actually, there is a selection:

Include previous replies at the bottom of emails: Always

This will give you the full thread of the topic with no stray content or missing posts, which happens sometimes in Google.

Jon Lewit
N26C #115 - Inua - Kingston, NY

13

Good pickup Jon. Part of the learning curve with any new app. But, as I think this project is starting to demonstrate, Discourse provides solutions that permit it’s use to be as similar to GG as you like, if that is what you like. But it does seem to offer much more and I’m at the point of thinking that the main loss in a migration, in the short term, would be that Discourse would not contain all the 6600 posts already in GG. That’s not much of a loss, in my opinion, as a large fraction of what’s contained in various threads has the flavor of conversation rather than information. There are ways to bring the information along, so I hope that gets consideration in the future implementation of something new. And if we stick to the old, I think the proven challenge of efficiently finding useful information in prior discussion threads will remain. In my view, this limitation probably curbs views and other participation in GG more than we know.

Michael Massagli
Nonsuch 22 #4, Piccola
lying Nanatasket MA

14

As a frequent poster on the Discussion Group since getting my first Nonsuch in 2017, I don’t know to what extent my content adds value.

I do know this, however. I have spent A LOT of time answering questions that were the topics of threads mere months before.

In the spirit of trying to be of service, and recognizing that navigating through the archives of the Google Discussion Group is unattractive to many, I don’t totally begrudge that time.

But I am getting burnt out as a would-be contributor.

I recognize that the Discussion Group is not just about information – it’s about finding people to connect with about shared interests.

Discourse has a couple of features lacking in Google that reduce the effort required to be helpful to people without losing the opportunity to share connections. One is that, when you go to start up a topic, it suggests related existing topics that you might join. Another is that it allows people to go back and add categories and tags, giving everyone additional ways to find things of interest to them.

These features make it easier to organize discussion threads, and easier for people to find existing information – without losing the connections to other people that makes going to the Discussion Group .

This strikes me as better for those of us who just use the Discussion Group, and A LOT better for those of us who are actively trying to add value to the Discussion Group.

As a volunteer trying to add value, I feel my time would be a lot better spent in Discourse than Google. In Discourse, I can help once by contributing to better organizing it. In Google, I end up using my time doing the same thing over and over and over – pointing people to the same information.

When people take a look at Discourse vs. Google, I hope they’ll consider not just what’s in for them, but also what’s in it for those of us who are actively trying to help make it useful to them.

– Bob
Me Gusta
Nonsuch e26U #233

15

Over the past two weeks, I’ve been using Discourse, and I believe switching to it will improve how INA members ask questions, find information, and share ideas.

When I joined INA four years ago, I was impressed by the INA website but surprised that communications relied on Google Groups—an outdated, buggy platform over 20 years old.

Here’s why I feel Discourse is the better choice:

  • Modern, intuitive interface – Easy to use on desktop and mobile.
  • Mobile-friendly – Create new topics from any device (Google Groups can’t).
  • Personalized posts – Automatically includes your name, boat name, location, and boat type from your profile
  • More control – Edit your topics after posting.
  • Smarter search – Find what you need without complicated queries like “Diesel AND heater”.
  • Better engagement – Alerts for similar topics before posting.
  • Easier photo uploads – Images display properly sized on all devices.
  • Valuable insights – Admins can track trends, new contributors, and popular discussions.

Running both platforms at once doesn’t make sense. If we switch to Discourse, try to import the Google Groups message into Discourse, but if that’s not practical, then Google Groups should be read-only. Many old posts (more than 8 to 10 years old) are of limited value—broken links, missing images, and outdated info—though some members may still find them useful.

It’s time for a modern, user-friendly solution that enhances communication for all INA members.

Jim Lieder
Nonsuch 30 Ultra #350
Lake St. Clair, MI

16

Here is an interesting discussion of the use of Dyneema . My concern regarding the choker is the lack of stretch. Sailing is a very dynamic thing and some flexibility is necessary to prevent damage from the shock loading. And from the article sun damage can vary exponential with latitude.

For a while it was popular to replace the lever shocks on older British cars with the more modern and reliable tube shocks we see now. Ops not so fast. The body design was not built to withstand the increased loads these tube shocks created .

Standing rigging like topping lifts and boom hangers where wire was used dyneema makes sense with proper precautions.

https://www.practical-sailor.com/sails-rigging-deckgear/when-should-we-retire-dyneema-stays-and-running-rigging