Getting our massive sails off the hanger lines and into the air is one of the few weak points in the simple single-handed design philosophy of your wonderful boats. I only have a humble 26 and have to do a lot of cranking on the winch to get that sail all the way to the top of the mast. I can only guess that it gets substantially harder for the 30s and beyond.
I was recently reading an article on making boating safer and EASIER for us aging sailors and one of the suggestions was to add some mechanical advantage to the halyard. Instead of attaching the halyard to the head of the sail he suggested putting a block there, running the halyard thru it and attaching it back at the top of the mast. This seems like a good idea to me despite having to deal with a bit more halyard tail to store in the cockpit while under way. The only potential disadvantage I see is that the additional friction may stop the sail from dropping quickly and completely into the hanger lines at the end of the day or (more likely) when you really need to dump that sail RIGHT NOW!
Has anybody out there tried this? What do you guys think of the idea?
One of his other big recommendations was to raise the lifelines to convert them form a tripping hazard to a true safety feature. Has anybody out there done that? I seems like a fairly cheap and simple upgrade to make. I’m 6’ 4’, and for me the top lifeline really is at a level appropriate to just pitch me over the side if I am thrown against it in a seaway.
My poor boat is currently frozen to the ground and surrounded by acres of sheet ice. Just checking the tarp is a truly death defying experience.
As long as there is someone else aboard, we jump the sail at the mast while someone tails in the cockpit. It I’m alone, we use the electric halyard winch.
Joe Valinoti
S/V IL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA
I’m almost always alone and besides; isn’t one of the reasons for us aging sailors to switch to a Nonsuch that (in theory) we never have to leave the safety of the cockpit?
I do have a Winchrite, but even with that helpful device, I usually have to crank the last couple of feet manually with the regular winch handle.
Hi Ralph
There was some discussion on the list about this problem a few years back. The result, I believe, was to try to reduce the friction in the system as much as possible. Having that extra block on the head would probably work but would also add some friction especially coming down. Other suggestions; never use stainless slides on a stainless track, soap the track, always ease the choker, and go to a smaller diameter halyard.
On my 26 I can raise the sail from the cockpit without the winch to about the last 2 feet. The track is stainless and the slides are bronze. The sail is a Botts sail with standard battens (not full length).
There is friction at the base of the mast turning block. It is the original. On my to do list is to replace this one with a ball bearing block.
Joe’s suggestion is the best. Send a crew to the mast the jump the halyard there. Fast and easy. I added a cam cleat just under the slot a few years ago so I can jump the halyard when single handing, now that the mast is out this year I have to clamp it properly but it works really well.
I have been thinking about adding a cam cleat or something similar on the mast of my 30 so that I can jump the main halyard most of the way up and then head back to the cockpit to winch up the last few feet. I wondered about placement and I note that you write that you mounted yours just under the slot. I assume you mean the slot that the halyard exits from on the mast.
How close or far from the slot did you mount it? Is it directly under the slot or at an angle? Does the halyard pop out of the cam cleat when you start to use the winch? I have wondered if the angle of the halyard from the slot to the block at the bottom of the mast would present any issues.
As I am sure most all would agree I would prefer not to put any more holes in the mast than necessary so if I can get this right the first time it will be best.
If you have a picture, I would certainly appreciate seeing it.
Thank. you in advance.
David
Spray 1981 30C #93
South Dartmouth and Westport Point Ma.
Being able to do all of the sail handling from the cockpit is a nice feature of the Nonsuches but I do jump the halyard at the mast nearly 100% of the time. From there, I can raise the sail to within two feet or so of the black band quickly and with considerably less effort than using the winch. Many years ago I fabricated and installed a cam cleat apparatus below the halyard exit slot in the mast so I can accomplish the task even when singlehanded.
I still swear by my HILTI drill - over 1100 inch pounds of torque - high quality - gets my sail up on my 22 very quickly and gets Ralph Bush’s sail up on his 26 real fast, too. It is a model SF 10W - A22. The whole kit runs around $500.00 (including a Winchbit - $90.00 Canadian) in Canada and much cheaper in the US. I use the smaller battery and it lasts a LONG time between charges. ..
I sail alone and have a bad shoulder - I don’t like (or need) to leave the cockpit. This lightweight and smallish drill has saved my life. I don’t like the idea of extra blocks, etc., on the main halyard.
I researched this idea a fair bit because, in truth, I don’t think that the Winchrite is really a quality piece of equipment (or that powerful) and it’s hell to get repaired (and costly, too).
In the interests of generating a more comprehensive list, here are some additional alternatives to consider:
Tides Marine Sail Track (https://www.tidesmarine.com/sailtrack/intst_overview.php) slides over the existing sail track and upgrades it to a track made from a very slippery, high-tech material. Doesn’t change halyard friction but virtually eliminates all track and slide friction. ($13.65 USD / foot of track, plus cost of putting matching slides on your sail.)
Upgrading to a larger manual winch might be cheaper than upgrading to an electric winch.
Cheap: Buy (or make) the longest winch handle that will work in the space you have available. A ten-inch handle gives 20% more leverage than an eight-incher. It’s not hard to make an extender.
From a cost standpoint, I don’t agree with the people recommending that you use crew to do the job. If they’re young enough, and strong enough, they’ll need to be fed – and that’ll end up costing way, way more in the long run.
Tides Marine sailtrack and Milwaukee Hillbilly Winchrite (as per Sandpiper), though I sheared the retaining bolt and just red loctited the chuck on…with a big 2 speed winch I can get the sail up fast and dangerously tight. Prefer to use a winch handle at the end for the feel when tensioning. Hillbilly Winchrite works well for the main, too (see attached), but i’ve figured out how I can avoid using it with luffing, except for hauling in tight for gybing. My HRG (Hudson River Gybe) needs some work, the one time I did it I removed a good bit of a swim ladder step - Kerbang! I think the HRG makes the Nonsuch Roundabout look like a dawdle!
Tides Marine sailtrack and Milwaukee Hillbilly Winchrite (as per Sandpiper), though I sheared the retaining bolt and just red loctited the chuck on…with a big 2 speed winch, I can get the sail up fast and dangerously tight. Prefer to use a winch handle at the end for the feel when tensioning. Hillbilly Winchrite works well for the main, too (see attached), but i’ve figured out how I can avoid using it with luffing, except for hauling in tight for gybing. My HRG (Hudson River Gybe) needs some work, the one time I did it I removed a good bit of a swim ladder step - Kerbang! I think the HRG makes the Nonsuch Roundabout look like a dawdle!
David, I don’t have a suitable picture and my boat is on the hard and inaccessible for another 4-6 weeks. In the meantime here is a description and sketch. The bracket is made of 1/8” aluminum, about 2” wide, 12-14” long bent into a squared off U shape, with two short tabs angling outward from each leg at the open end. The closed end of the U is about 4 long, the legs of the U about 3” and the tabs 1-2”. The cam cleat is mounted on the inside of the closed end of the U bracket, with the line entry side facing upward. The bracket is positioned over the main halyard, 8-9’ feet off the deck and attaches to the mast with a hose clamp that goes around the mast, over the tabs and through slots at the junctions of the legs and tabs (and under the halyard and sail track). To engage the halyard in the cam cleat you just pull the halyard slightly away from the mast and downward. The beauty of this setup, as opposed to simply mounting a cam cleat directly on the mast, is that as soon as you apply any additional tension on the halyard, the halyard pulls out of the cam cleat and runs free. It is quite ingenious and sounds much more complicated than it really is.
You’re very welcome but I can’t take credit for the idea. Read about it years ago on this list, saw it in an old copy of the Update, or maybe saw it on a sistership somewhere. It does work well.
Ernie,
I just checked the Hilti site. The new SF 10W-a ATC is listed at 637 in-lbs of torque. They do not list a SF10W-A22. I tried a Milwaukee18 slot cordless drill rated at 650 in-lbs of torque for my 26. In the beginning it would hoist the sail from bottom to top but after I had used it a few times the (yes I recharged the batteries) the batteries seemed to lose some capacity and the overheat protection would shut the drill down before the sail got to full hoist.
Later I was given a Winchrite (original model) as a gift. It will haul the sail full hoist without a problem but it is slower than the Milwaukee. I always do the final adjustment wiht the winch handle. I have also hoisted a 200 lb plus man to the top of the mast on his Spencer 42 with the Winchrite. The Winchrite is expensive and not designed for easy service although I think the new models allow for easier battery changes.
If I have been sailing regularly and am feeling fit I will hoist the sail by hand and then use the winch handle to harden the halyard. When I feel lazy I use the Winchrite. The dodger prevents me from swinging the winch handle 360 degrees. The halyard winch is two speed so it becomes a matter of easy hard easy hard winching.
